Sunday, August 14, 2011

Episode 62 Watch the "IT"

Episode 62 Watch the "IT"

George Orwell on being a "minority of one", Silence of the Lambs on "IT's", Kanye West/Jay Z on "Watch the Throne" and consumerism taking us from "Murder to Excellence", PETA vs FARM on "Welfare Reform" and "Abolition" at Americas "National Animal Rights Conference", "Heartlights" and "Someone in the Dark", Non Vegan Alice Walker, Ferris Bueller and respecting other animals as our friends.  All in Episode 62 :-)

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Coexisting With Nonhuman Animals iTunes link

Hello and welcome to a fairly average episode of Coexisting With Nonhuman Animals, "Watch the "IT" "

I'd like to thank Thomas Janek for mentioning me in a recent interview held with activist John Sakars, Thomas interviewed me about a year ago for his radio show Wild Time, all this time later, Thomas remembered my little whine about being the only Vegan I knew (at the time)

I'm glad to say I've met at least five Vegans who live here in person, and that I'll meet more in the future.  I have nothing to complain about, although I do wish Invercargill had a Vegan restaurant like the ones in Auckland! :-)  To anyone listening who hasn't met another Vegan in person, hang in there, start your own one member Vegan Society, if for no other reason than to have fun, and to give yourself "extra respect" by sending in cranky letters to newspapers, using your newly made up title.  I wouldn't be surprised if you met other Vegans in your area, , or in neighboring areas too, surely you'll at least make some great friends online.  You're not a crazy person, like George Orwells 1984 mentions, 

He wondered, as he had many times wondered before, whether he himself was a lunatic. Perhaps a lunatic was simply a minority of one

  • There was truth and there was untruth, and if you clung to the truth even against the whole world, you were not mad.
  • Sanity is not statistical.

Great book that 1984, well worth establishing a, at the time, one man Vegan society around, along with Animal Farms "all animals are equal" quote.

I wanted to mention the Animals Australia "Ban Live Export to Indonesia" campaign.  I've seen the video for a recent Animals Australia ad, focused on welfare, jobs, "being nice to animals" etc, by killing them there in Australia, yaaa!

The "lets keep jobs in Austra'ya" guy is obviously a slaughterhouse worker, someone who kills these other animals for his living.  

I think we can do one better, lets promote Veganism!  That way we avoid New Zealanders feeling "better" about what we do to Animals here, because unlikely those AWFUL Australians, we don't "live export" and, the Australians wont feel Indonesia or Muslim people in general are any more "cruel" to other animals than they are.  Promoting Veganism helps all animals, and everywhere, not just X being sent to Y from Z, all the Chickens, Pigs and Sheep too.  

Heres a quick story: 

"A man who lived among the rotting remains of 11 women was convicted Friday of killing all of them, bringing closure to a case that has haunted the city of Cleveland ever since the bodies were unearthed from a house that smelled like death.

When the bodies were found, police concluded that a nearby sausage shop wasn't the source of the lingering stench of rotting meat, as many neighbors had believed. The family-owned shop had spent $20,000 on plumbing fixtures, sewer lines and grease traps in futile attempts to get rid of the odor."

I found that story interesting as its so dramatic, "rotting remains", and the house "smelled like death", whatever thats meant to mean.  The nearby "sausage shop" was suspected, for that quote "lingering stench of rotting meat"…gee, its almost like we humans are animals too, that our bodies also rot, and are made of "meat" too, huh, who would have thought?  

I have some clips from a recent debate at the National Animal Rights Conference, not the New Zealand one, some jerks in some other country ALSO held "the National Animal Rights Conference", in some country you've never heard of, tucked away at the TOP of the world.  Here is a debate with

Bruce Friedrich (PETA) , Alex Hershaft (Farm Animal Rights Movement) debate "Abolition vs Welfare Reform" strategy clips …… I don't agree with either necessarily, I'm a "Vegan against PETA", I don't like their campaigns, their naked women and sexual stunts, I don't like how they ask Canadians to boycott Killing Friendly Chickens…that is until they start gassing to death my little friends, the PETA endorsed "Humane Way" of gassing innocent little birds to death… ok, well its more a lack of oxygen, drowning without oxygen than being killed by a gas per say, but you get my drift, PETA endorse this "lovely" way of killing my Chicken friends.  Of course I havnt met the millions of Chickens being killed in Canada, I've only visited Australia and this other country called "Auckland",  only kidding, its New Zealands largest city, I've never been to North America.  I like to think "Strangers are just friends you havnt met yet", if those Chickens were staying here with me, I bet they'd be eating grain out of my hand within a week, that we would be friends.

From what I've seen, FARM also promote "go veg" style campaigns, with a "Meatout Monday", it might sound picky, but I'd rather support a group that supported "Vegan Everyday".  I don't agree with either group, INVSOC, the Invercargill Vegan Society has my full support, and thats because I founded the thing myself, ruling with an iron fist, if I decide peanut butter is superior to raspberry jam on toast, then thats official Invercargill Vegan Society policy.

Here is Hershaft explaining his view first

This paying someone an American dollar, ie a worthless bit of paper, for watching four minutes is a little odd to me, do you think its effective?  Lets assume its graphic, ie honest, real video of what happens to destroy a someONE and make a someTHING on your plate, are people going to say "ooh, I would have walked away, but in this financial climate, with bills to pay, I'd do anything for a dollar!  Why, for one USD per four minutes, thats $15 USD an hour, I'll take this job sir, I'll be your video watcher!"

I'm not sure.  If it works, paying people a whole American dollar, enough to buy a stalk of celery, um, sure, ok?

Ok, so everyone is on his side, the Vegans in the crowd agree with promoting Veganism, and not just because they found out there were TWO USD under their seat for listening to FARM for the EIGHT minutes…hmm, maybe thats why they were clapping….lets see what happens when Bruce Friedrich speaks, if the crowd still agrees with promoting Veganism outright, or if PETA has more than a dollar or two to throw around…if the choice between getting a dollar or some kind of lettuce lady "I'd rather look at boobies than get a dollar" peep show is the greater bribe:

Good joke…not!  Who the hell buys Newspapers in 2011?!?!  They were OBVIOUSLY bribed with a crisp dollar bill to clap for that

Ok, starting off fairly good Mr Bruce Fried Rich, thats how I always see his name, Friedrich, Fried Rich, getting the crowd on his side, "I've been Vegan for a long time, I respect that other guy talking before me, if you liked what he said, you should like me too…but………"

better ways of unjustly killing people?  We sure as hell didn't do that in New Zealand mate, we banned all capital punishment, true, for everything but the crime of alleged Treason first, then everything later, but we DIDNT spend all our time and effort on better ways to kill New Zealand citizens…. the same with the New Zealand ban against Nuclear weapons, Nuclear powered weapons of mass destruction coming into our harbors from other countries, we said get the blink out, we took a stand, we didn't roll over, tongue hanging out like good little Democrats, we stood the hell up for a principle, this is unacceptable damn it, get that thing the hell out of here.  True, New Zealand telling America not to bring their weapons into our country, the Superpower fighting a second Superpower, the Soviet Union, what did they have to fear from a country of a couple million people?  Well, we stood up to them, we said no damnit, we would have nonviolently walked over the water, us Southern Hemisphere people have that power you know, we would have climbed into the barrels of their guns, put ourselves through the warships propellers, we would have jammed the machinery with our own spines, we'd have stood up for what we believed in, and it would have been non violent….. unless you count half the country being munched up by gears, cogs, radiation and other assorted machinery as violent I guess.

Less dramatically, and more factually, we made ourselves heard, our Prime Minister spoke in a debate with representatives of the USA, the whole world saw what we believed in, what we stood for.  I've linked to the debate video in my shownotes, at the bottom of this episodes script, which you can find at Coexisting With Nonhuman

And you know what?  This little Chihuahua's yapping made the big dog back away, our country is Anti Nuclear, anti Death Penalty.  Although, we do have our share of people screeching about "a slap over the hand with a wet bus ticket" when murderers get five years in prison or whatever, and apparently one of our prisons in Auckland gives all inmates televisions and Non Vegan ice-cream every night to keep them good little boys and girls.

Lets stand up for what we believe in, we are Vegan, we believe other animals matter, lets tell what we believe to be the truth.  Its not like we have to foul up the Slaughterhouse machinery with our very bodies….um….right?

is crap….noooo, he didn't really say that last bit, but boy, what he DID say…

The idea that Vegans promoting Veganism use graphic ie honest videos of actual conditions "to help our campaigns"…. while many of my friends DO show potentially upsetting video, I don't.  I made the decision not use use violent images as a primary educational material.  I've built up a callus to other animals being killed, shot, cut, bled to death…. I feel like I've seen it all before, that I've turned off my tears, my sadness and turned UP my love….that sounds like a sappy romantic song, right? 

HA, you call that an emotional song written ABOUT the movie ET?  I'm an unreliable narrator though listeners, when I want you to laugh AT a clip, I make sure to play an AM radio/vinyl record sounding copy,   when I want you to enjoy a clip, I make sure its good, iPhone quality, like, oh, lets say THIS one, written FOR the movie ET, by one M Jackson:

Thats a damn right, what a great song, Someone in the Dark, by Michael Jackson, I think about my lost Chicken Friends while hearing that song, but rather than pretending "your lost pets are the brightest star in the sky son" or that one day I'll see them again in some wonderland on top of the clouds, you know, after I *DIE*, a place where my homosexual friends wont be allowed in past St Peter,  the bouncer guarding the Non Vegan gates made from pearls…. its nicer to realise my lost friends are NOT some huge ball of gas a few trillion lightyears away, that I'll never be able to see except for when Mr Sun is taking a nap…nor that they live on in my glowing heart, what am I, bloody Ironman?  But that I can see Ms Hen and Mr Rooster anytime I like, through my videos taken of us all together, many of which are on YouTube, in my memories of them, in the Hens still with us, they are dead, they live on in memory.

I've built up a callus to graphic images, through repeated exposure I no longer get upset by past events, theres nothing we can do to help those dead, we CAN help the living.  The only emotion I want to instill in people listening is of awe, to be blown away that there ever was as talented an individual as Michael Jackson around.  Oh, and if theres side effects of respect for other animals, thats a bonus too.  

I like to focus on gentle videos of my Chicken Friends, I usually don't edit the videos in any way, I press record on my phone, I press stop, I upload the video to YouTube to share with others.  They are lovely for who they are, they don't need any overdubbing or visual effects.  We should respect them for who they are, not who they belong to, they matter for being themselves, for being someone.

I *do* believe The Animals Film and Earthlings are valuable resources, I wouldn't immediately show them to someone though, I wouldn't want to make the focus of my Veganism "YOU DONT WANT TO BE AN EVIL, CRUEL EXPLOITER, DO YOU, DO YOU?!?!?!  LOOK AT THE BLOOD, THATS YOUR FAULT!"…. I want to present a case that Chicken Friends are just as valuable as you or I, assuming you're not in fact a Chicken Friend listening in to this episode on your iPod Touch.

You know who really DOES focus on finding the most gruesome videos, the same handful of photos and videos of a few dying, among all the tens of billions killed each year?  Why, the Welfare promoting groups, who seem to be able to say "you see this blood and guts?  this is CRUEL, this is WRONG, this is INHUMANE….", they can just say "you see?  you see?  we have to stop this…", as if thats a case in itself.    From the two presentations, Alex Hershaft of FARM and Bruce Fried…. Friedrich of PETA, who focused on showing cages and "cruel treatment"?   Now, apparently they BOTH show potentially upsetting evidence of Non Veganism, but its far from a tenet of promoting Veganism, "thou shalt upset thou Non Vegans watching with graphically revolting-ist imagery-thou…", whereas it seems to make up the WHOLE campaign for *welfare reforms*.

"oh, they just want them to keep suffering so they can benefit from this as a cruel resource to show…", what a cheap thing to say, and not cheap as in being given a dollar, but cheap as in "…and nasty".  

"we're optimistic, they're pessimistic"….portraying Vegans promoting Veganism and never asking for larger cages as negative, grumpy moaners, while Fried Rich and co are all naked porn stars and victory?  Come on!  I'm optimistic about promoting Veganism, we ARE making change, and not change as in "can you give me change for a dollar", and getting four of these "quarters" I've heard so much about, but in making invaluable change for those being hurt and killed.  You cant put a price on friendship.  Although, you can apparently put a price on watching four minutes of video, as well as getting a salary out of promoting welfare reforms.

I agree with Professor Gary Francione when he explains Veganism should be seen as part of the peace movement.  We can see ways that our own actions, our choices represent our society.

Look at the UK, people fighting, breaking windows to steal tvs, shoes and shirts….chavs fighting to get gold jewelry….guess I cant talk, you've all seen those three movies about New Zealanders fighting over a single gold ring…. I hear a couple more of those movies are coming out sometime soon, for the love of dog people, PLEASEEEEE see them, help out the New Zealand economy! :-)

I'm thrilled the new Jay Z, Kanye West album "Watch the Throne" has been released, and not only because it shows its now acceptable to like Michael Jackson,  you never would have heard this back when he was in the tabloids all the time, the false accusations:

I particularly like this song from the album,  "Murder to Excellence", going from one to the other, it samples two songs, one "Celie shaves Mr, Scarification Ceremony" from The Colour Purple, written by Alice Walker, the Non Vegan woman known for, well rather than take credit for someone elses work, I'll read from a blog post of Doris Lin's 

The animals of the world exist for their own reasons. They were not made for humans any more than black people were made for whites or women for men."
The problem is the quote is taken out of context, and Walker wasn't expressing her own views. The source of the quote is Walker's preface to Marjorie Spiegel's 1988 book, "The Dreaded Comparison". In fact, the very next sentence is "This is the gist of Ms. Spiegel's cogent, humane and astute argument, and it is sound."

Doris included a picture of the page with that full quote, which I've linked to in my show notes.

And as my good friend, Honorary INVSOC member and close personal friend of Invercargill Mayor Tim Shadbolt Lucas found, Alice Walker's review of "The Vegetarian Myth", that we should kill other animals for our health was used by author and ex Vegan Lierre Keith:

"The Vegetarian Myth is one of the most important books people, masses of them, can read, as we try with all our might, intelligence, skill, hope, dream and memory, to turn the disastrous course the planet is on. It's a wonderful book, full of thoughtful, soulful teachings, and appropriate rage. My admiration for Lierre's sharing of life experience and knowledge is complete."

-Alice Walker

Thanks for your comment on Mylenes My Face is on Fire blog Lucas, I'll link to it in shownotes.

Surely if someone has to be quoted, we can pick a Vegan who promotes Veganism?  Otherwise its like calling Peter Singer "the father of the Animal Rights movement", when he doesn't believe in rights as a Utilitarian, and is a quote "impure Vegan".

Personally, I like to think photos and videos of my Chicken Friends count as quotes, as living statements of why we should respect other animals, including Chickens.  It works out cheap too, get it, cheep?, I don't have to pay them any royalties for using their quote.

Heres the song from The Colour Purple sampled by Jay Z and Kanye West:

<The Color Purple - 25. Celie Shaves Mr./Scarification Ceremony sample, the colour purple (Alice Walker quote) >
Not terrible, but not Quincy Jones best work, the guy worked on Thriller!

More recognizable as a sample is this Romanian song:

And heres the the new song using those samples:

In the video for the song OTIS, they take a 300,000 USD Maybach car and cut the roof off, weld bits on…apparently they ARE going to auction it off to help an African drought charity, we can enjoy these multi millionaires kind of ruin a car, shoot a video about how rich and powerful they are, and then someone is to buy the car, because it famous just having been around them, with the money going to help people who don't have a dollar to their name?  Couldn't we instead let these people watch a four minute video a few times?

About the numbers of deaths in one American city compared to all US forces killed in Iraq, Kanye was meaning 2008 when 314 American soldiers died in Iraq, and Chicago reported 509 people dying in violent crimes.  It makes you think right, violence is everywhere, perhaps we might think of the killing of Whales as some legendary evil, but no doubt our own countries kills more Pigs, Sheep, Goats and Chickens than the number of Whales killed overseas.  Veganism - non violence -  fits in everywhere.

Apart from making fun of those of us with a lisp, Jay makes a good point, um, without meaning to, Silence of the lambs, Jay links wearing a sheep's SKIN coat with the "silencing", KILLING of lambs….

Silence of the Lambs made me seriously think about being Vegetarian, and later my understand of Veganism,  the whole killing others, treating them as an "IT", IT puts the lotion on ITS skin or else IT gets the hose again…the idea of owning someone else, at least in our own minds, through our strength over them, tanning human skin, tanning the skin of other animals, the senator in the televised video using the kidnapped womans name, CATHERINE, to try and make it stick in the killers mind that she is a PERSON, she has a name , she's not an IT, to try and make it harder to kill *HER*…

Its all there in Silence of the Lambs people!

USA sounds out of control, freedoms restricted, looks like we better "liberate" them….I'm sure I'll be greeted with open arms as I claim Texas as my own, they have lots of oil still, right?  Black Gold?  Texas Tea?  And Barbara, Cyndi, when *I'm* in control of Texas, you'll be allowed to give out all the home made Vegan food you like.

Chicago corruption, when Obama got in, talk of all his cronies coming too, the phrase used on every news channel was "Chicago Style Politics", of all levels being completely corrupt, monopolies, backroom deals, bickering, strong arm tactics…the mafia really… but that was "just a fact of life" in Chicago….?

Heres a clip from the Daily show about Blogovich, that corrupt jerk who had all kinds of shady deals, selling political seats in Chicago to exert influence….

I see Veganism as looking at ourselves in the Michael Jackson mentioned Mirror, that rather than blaming others, often far away, doing things we ourselves do not participate in, we instead look at what WE are responsible for, what we CAN be responsible for.  That instead of having Chickens killed and Fried for us, we can have Chickens Friends Cuddled, assuming they want to be picked up, like when Black Chick chooses to sit on my knee and be patted.

This Chicago situation seems nuts, this giant American city, corrupt from top to bottom politically?  

Well, my next geocache is about a fictional person from Chicago, Ferris Bueller, from the 1980's movie Ferris Buellers Day Off, I've hidden an ex army ammo tin containing a DVD copy of the movie, to be borrowed, in my city, for people to find the starting spot through GPS, the coordinates for the initial spot are given, then they play an audio recording I've made, walking the route to find two clues, each giving half the final locations GPS coordinates.  

Ferris Bueller, Chicagos finest Fictional son…although even he lied to his family by pretending to be sick, using all kinds of synthesizers and mannequins in his bed…so he could skip school, steal a classic Ferrari and visit an art museum, sing in a parade…. thats, apparently, Chicago for ya!

References are important, as proven by this recent New Zealand celebrity story:

"...An aspiring actor and his mum forced themselves to eat two dinners last night after strolling down the street and spotting actor Orlando Bloom through the window of a Lone Star restaurant.
"We weren't originally going out for dinner, we'd already eaten ... but we got ourselves a table at Lone Star and sat there with the man himself," Liz Rayes, of Auckland, said.
Rayes and her 16-year-old son Daniel Crocombe, a student at Kristin High School in Albany, were walking to the corner store about 9pm to buy bottled water when they first noticed Bloom, back in the capital for filming of the Hobbit.
Despite having eaten already, the star-struck vegetarians booked a table at the predominantly meaty restaurant just to get a glimpse of the star.
"He was dining out with three other guys, we got him to sign our Lone Star menu and as he was walking out of the restaurant we got a photo of him."

Not sure how a reporter would get this info, did the fans go to the Herald with "gee, that Orlando Bloom is a really nice man, and we should support him (and the New Zealand Economy) by going to those Hobbit movies…"

Sounds like a PR stunt for The Hobbit ;-)

In any way, theres no way the reporter would have asked "…are you vegetarians…", right?  Obviously they would have said something like "…we don't normally go to this restaurant, we're actually Vegetarian…."

I think its great to mention that we are VEGAN, that we should always make the most of an opportunity to promote Veganism.  Just by having the word in our largest national newspaper, you know, those things people don't buy anymore?  Well, by having it on the WEBSITE of the largest national text based reporting company thing, it really is important, it would be a free ad for Veganism.  I honestly don't remember ever hearing the term "Vegan" before I was essentially Vegan, certainly I was a self described "Vegetarian", and I think everyone born in the past fifty years has some kind of understanding of that term, "Vegetarian",  "they don't eat meat", we're making Vegan have a similar level of mainstream-ness.

Hopefully it can be more accurate than "they don't eat meat" though!  Interesting how Non Vegans use terms such as "I eat meat", while probably being upset if we said "…we disagree about killing other animals…"

Always be sure to mention being Vegan, whenever you can!

"you have that power, other animals we kill by the tens of billions are very gentle and kind, talk to them and you'll see, you're in charge of what happens to them…I know you can feel love and compassion, you have a wonderful chance to show the whole world you can be merciful, as well as strong.  Go Vegan, you have that power"  

Thank you for listening to Coexisting With Nonhuman Animals.

You can find the script for this episode, as well as downloads for every episode of Coexisting With Nonhuman Animals at coexisting with nonhuman animals . co .nz

If you want to contact me, I'd really love to hear from YOU, please send me an email to

I'm also on Facebook and Twitter, Jordan Wyatt, W Y A T T

Thank you for listening.


New Zealand Prime Minister debates Nuclear Weapons

part of the video

Wildtime interview with John Sakars, "some Vegans havnt met others…" ie my old whine story :-)

INVSOC Badge I sent to Thomas :-)

American man living with dead bodies of those he'd killed

Neil Diamond "heartlight" sappy song, written afterwards about the movie ET 

A REAL emotional song written FOR ET, "Someone in the Dark" by Michael Jackson yo!

Alice Walker review of Lierre Keiths "Vegetarian Myth"

""The Vegetarian Myth is one of the most important books people, masses of them, can read, as we try with all our might, intelligence, skill, hope, dream and memory, to turn the disastrous course the planet is on. It's a wonderful book, full of thoughtful, soulful teachings, and appropriate rage. My admiration for Lierre's sharing of life experience and knowledge is complete."

-Alice Walker"

Mylene's blogpost about Alice Walker quote:

Doris Lin on "that Alice Walker quote"

La La La song (sampled in "Murder to Excellence")

The Color Purple - 25. Celie Shaves Mr./Scarification Ceremony (from The Colour Purple, turn down the quality from that ridiculous 720…its NOT HD…its not even a video, just a static picture!!!!)

Orlando Bloom, Vegetarians meet him

Chicago Style Politics

AR 2011 US conference

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